Southwark Workhouse Records

[Norfolk Nan]

FamilySearch has thrown up a record for John Lee, born 14 April 1865 to John and Ellen Lee at St George the Martyr workhouse, Southwark. I can't find any reference to this event on Ancestry or the GRO so wondered if anyone can glean more info please? Any additional information would be very useful. Thank you.

[VALLMO9]

I'm not seeing St George the Martyr Workhouse in the drop-down menus within Ancestry's London, England, Workhouse Admission and Discharge Records, 1764-1921 collection. And the only record for STGTM in the London, England, Poor Law and Board of Guardian Records, 1738-1926 set is for a Marriage Notice Book 1848-1856.

A range of name indexes have been produced from original poor law records held at Southwark Local History Library and Archive and at the Surrey History Centre in Woking. These include records of workhouse inmates, settlement examinations, affiliation orders and minutes of meetings.
The fullest surviving Poor Law records relate to the parishes of St Mary Newington, and St George the Martyr. Some of their original material is currently unavailable. Contact SLHL and SHC for more information on accessing these items.

Records of the local Boards of Guardians, which were formed in 1834, are mostly deposited in the London Metropolitan Archives, as are the earlier Poor Law records of some parishes.

[Norfolk Nan]

Thanks, Mo. I'll try the local history folks as you suggested

[VALLMO9]

Just out of interest, what year is the FS record you've seen for John Lee (born April 1865)?

Also, bear in mind that many of the Southwark archives, including Poor Law records are currently unavailable due to the Town Hall fire of March 2013.

[Norfolk Nan]

Well, call off the search! I found the birth register for the workhouse on Ancestry (quite by chance) and found the entry for 14th April 1865 and the entry is for a female child, parents Ellen and John Lee. No name given. All very disappointing as FamilySearch say Ellen and John had a son, John, on 14th April 1865.

It was just a long-shot, I'm still trying to find a registeration or baptism for a John Lee who claims (in 1939 reg docs) his dob is 18th April 1864 and in various census that he was born in Isleworth. I've never found evidence that is true. Parents were both Irish but that's all I know of them aside from their names (not MMN). Just another one of my annoying brick walls, Mo Thanks for your interest.

[VALLMO9]

He may have been born in Ireland, but assumed his birthplace was Isleworth.

[Norfolk Nan]

That's what I think but I can't prove it. They did live in Isleworth when he was young. I can't pinpoint his parent's marriage (no MMN) or either place of birth (always state Ireland on census). Only one known child according to 1911 census. A lot of blanks...

[Mick Loney]

Norfolknan,
In case you are not aware, the 1921 census can be a bit more specific when stating place of birth. My ggmother was shown variously as being born in Ireland, or Cork. It wasn’t until 1921 that her place of birth was stated to be Skibbereen, (a parish in Cork).

[Norfolk Nan]

Mick, thank you for that - just to be sure I double-checked and not only has he added years to his age making his dob now 1860 (probably to cover that his wife is a few years older) but his place of birth is Poplar, London! Why hadn't I noticed this before? I know this is the right man, he lived at the address for years and well into living memory.

The couple's marriage certificate is full of inaccuracies to cover up that she had been married to a bigamist before and had three children, I can't find him anywhere in 1881, I think he's with his parents in Wales in 1871 when the census says all three were born in Ireland but the ages were wrong so who knows if they are the right family. A long list of 'facts' from the horses mouth have been impossible to prove. He's definately a challenge. And now he's thrown Poplar into the mix!!!

[Mick Loney]

Norfolk Nan,
I know that area well, my parents etc came from Limehouse, and some of them also came from Ireland